Join host Aaron Burnett as he sits down with Carmine White, CEO of Adrian’s Housekeeping, to talk about bouncing back from bankruptcy, scaling from $50,000 to $5M in revenue, and why learning to let go was the key to building a thriving, people-first business.

Note, this podcast features real entrepreneurs sharing real challenges and solutions. No pitches, no sales - just honest conversations about the moments that shape successful businesses.

Aaron Burnett: So I was looking at your professional history. You have had quite the entrepreneurial journey. Yes. Tell me a little bit of that story.

Carmine White: I guess it started when, we moved to Las Vegas when I was a teenager. I was, I went to school for civil engineering., went to community college where I was able to do part-time of high school and college with that at the same time, yeah.

Right after high school I started working for Nevada Power,, in Las Vegas. And,, I just got really, I read a book that changed my life, called Rich Ad Poor Ad that set me on this trajectory of like, of entrepreneurship. And then I just started beca, I was always a voracious reader, but like, I just started consuming entrepreneur content and I really wanted to go off and, start my own business.

So I dabbled with a couple of little things, you know, around then, like in my early twenties,, and. I ended up, doing a real estate deal. I started buying real estate. I ended up doing this commercial real estate deal that was kind of like a six figure windfall., and that let me quit my job and go out and pursue something.

And so how old were you? I was tw when I did that deal, I was like 23. Wow. It's not what I was doing when I was 23. Yeah. Well I was, I was scrambling around. I kind of got lucky. I, you know, that's a totally different story, but like, kind of got lucky with this deal. Yeah., but I wanted to try all these different.

Things and what I ended up doing is getting into sales. So I started in, in Las Vegas. The pool industry was a huge industry for us. And, my friend was just launching a sale, a pool business. And so I jumped off and joined him with that. I didn't have any ownership with it, but I kind of tried to take this as a lesson for me to be on my own and, you know, not have a salary to fall back on.

So we, we started selling a ton of pools in Las Vegas. I mean, our average pool price was like 130,000., we were doing like these really great projects. I was making so much money. I felt like I was on top of the world. I was in my early twenties. My wife and I got married when I was 24. Yeah, it went really well right up until 2008, basically.

The entire pool industry collapsed, fell off the map. It like basically, you know, between 2008 and 2009, almost no pools were built in Las Vegas. Right. So this entire industry collapsed and we had a bunch of real estate that we lost in that process. So we like, we ended up filing bankruptcy and you know, it was just like this crazy time.

Like a total economic meltdown.

Aaron Burnett: You had to file personal bankruptcy?

Carmine White: We filed personal bankruptcy. Yeah. We ended up filing personal bankruptcy a couple years ago, but it was like. To kind of clear up all those old Sure. You know, like past debts., and so like that was around that time I ended up. Joining a business, kind of a startup business, where we were importing hardwood flooring.

It was somebody I knew that I had done a real estate deal with in the past. I joined as an equity owner in this business, where we were importing. We got a distributorship basically in the entire Midwest, and we started importing a bunch of hardwood flooring from China. Mm-hmm. And we started just basically scaling that up.

So, I, we'd moved to Montana and spent, spent a year trying to scale that up and then. Kind of around that time I realized, like, this is not what I want to be doing in my life. I ended up exiting that business and that's when we moved to Washington and, about a year after that we started the business that we currently have Washington.

So, so when did you move to Washington? Late 2010. Okay. Yeah. And then, yeah, and then we ended up starting this business in 2011, basically. And

Aaron Burnett: what's your current business?

Carmine White: So it's called Adrian's Housekeeping. My wife Adrian. So she was, I was, I was actually pursuing a different type of business, more in my, in, in the electrical, you know, engineering field, which is what I'd worked in before.

And she was cleaning houses on the side, what I was doing with a partner. We were kind of got frozen a little bit with what, what I was pursuing. She was just getting a lot of referrals. What she was doing with cleaning. And so I was like, well, why don't I just step off and help? Like I could build a website.

And right around that time we found out she was pregnant. And so I was, I was like, so we talked about it a lot and the idea was either. We need to like wind this down 'cause this is not sustainable all the way through being pregnant and having a kid. Or we go and hire some employees. And so that's where we started.

Right? Then we, you know, we decided to go that route, built a website. I joined a local organization called BNI. We just started like pushing out there and so I think our first year we did 50,000., and since then we've been just scaling up. I mean we're currently a total head count is 65., last year we were just under 5 million revenue, about 900 recurring customers in, in East Side, a local area.

Do you exclusively serve the east side? We partially acquired a company last year, over based, that has a footprint in Seattle, but we, that we have not really expanded. Its Seattle. That's kind of the next phase of our expansion.

Aaron Burnett: Yeah.

Carmine White: We are very much like a family owned business with people that are deeply enmeshed in the community.

Uh, you know, there's a lot of companies out there that are hiring, you know, just lasting, you know, spending massive marketing budgets on just hiring independent contractors. Yeah. That don't go through any vetting and, you know, they're just marketing companies that, that just happen to be in house cleaning business.

Whereas ours is very much like we have all of our people come into our office every day. We're holding constant meetings, we're holding constant trainings. There's, you know, there's a lot of hands on. Touch from everybody in our company. So it's a totally different type of experience than what a lot of the companies are that are out there.

And so I, I feel like that's important. You told me a little bit about the size of the business today. Yeah.

Aaron Burnett: Describe

Carmine White: the services that you provide. Yeah. Ideal client for you. Most of our clients right now are professionals like the, Redmond, Kirkland, Bellevue, Spanish area., you know, we have a lot of customers who are, you know, Microsoft or Amazon or Boeing.

Type employees, right? We do almost exclusively house cleaning. We're like 98% residential. We send out teams and company in our uniforms, in our company vehicles, you know, with our equipment and that kind of thing. And so the teams go in and, you know, we,, we kind of customize. Part of I think of how we've grown is.

Is, we're very flexible on customizing what we do for the customer. And so we work with the customer to try and set a budget of time that we are there and then we, you know, and then we do that and then try and get them on the same, same regular rotation, try and pair 'em up with the right team and Yeah.

You know?

Aaron Burnett: Yeah. So practically, how does that work? We also have a, a house cleaner who comes. Yeah. So you set a, a budget of time. Yeah. As needs change, let's say I have someone coming in week to week. Yeah. Is, uh, does what's accomplished change as well, based on my changing needs? Yeah.

Carmine White: I would say most people have the similar things, like, pretty much everybody needs their bathrooms and their floors done, you know, like kitchen, straightening up, that kind of thing.

So, uh, there may be needs that change would, which is like, you know, I, I have guests coming in, I have a party I'm preparing for. Right. You know,, that kind of thing. But most of the, most of the things are pretty common., our big thing is trying to track notes, you know, for like people's preferences. For the preferences on like, I like my bed done this certain way, you know?

Sure. Every single person is different. So key part of us is, is like, you know, we have a, a customer team service team dedicated to tracking that. So we send out like. Reminder emails that we're gonna be there or texts. Customers can opt in and have like text notifications When we're on the way or finished, we send out these one click surveys where they can rate their cleaning.

And all the way throughout that we're collecting feedback from customers on anything they wanna change. And then we, we try and make sure that's communicated really well to the teams that are doing it.

Aaron Burnett: And if I'm your

Carmine White: client, do I have the same cleaning staff week over week? We try to do that, but it's really hard.

Sure. If we were sending just one person and we were just pairing up one person with, with the customer, that's a lot easier. 'cause then that person, you know, if you cancel for the day, like we just tell that person, oh, you don't have any work. We do it differently because we work in teams of three.

Sometimes we have a team leader, but then sometimes we have people that are sick. Like currently we have three of our team members who are pregnant. You know what I mean? Like Yeah. There is natural shifting. Sure. You know, and so,, our goal is to. Almost never will we cancel on somebody if we have somebody out sick.

We have flexibility on being able to make sure that we're not like canceling or screwing up the expectation on service, but we do our best. But it's not a perfect science.

Aaron Burnett: But if somebody arrives at my house and for whatever reason, it's not the, the team that I've typically had, they have notes that tell them exactly, exactly what's in the house and what

Carmine White: things need to be cleaned.

Exactly right. We should have, you should, it should be completely seamless because. All that feedback we've gotten over all the years is documented. You know, so when they pull up in the app and they, you know, before they go in the house, they sit there and review with the team about the priorities and, you know, and they all know what they're doing for the regular cleaning, but like, it's, it's getting the specialized stuff dialed in is, is the key thing.

Aaron Burnett: Yeah. Before we continue, I want to tell you about the community that made this podcast possible. The Seattle chapter of eo, that's Entrepreneurs Organization. It's not networking, it's not selling to each other. It's real entrepreneurs sharing real challenges and solutions. If you have a business that does at least a million a year in revenue, and you're curious about joining a community that gets what you're going through.

Check out EOCF. So with your rate of growth, I would imagine your rate of client retention is very high as well.

Carmine White: Client retention is really high. Currently right now of our revenue, 90% of our revenue is recurring, but 10% of our revenue is new customers trying us out and, and, and that kind of thing. So,

Aaron Burnett: and so what does it look like?

If I am interested and I want check you out, how do I go about that?

Carmine White: I mean, we have a team that like put puts together a quote. We don't send people out to go, you know, do an estimate unless it's like something very special, but sure. Typically what? We'll, we'll have a conversation and say, okay, you know, what are your top priorities?

Okay, so for this square foot size house, let's say your house is, I dunno, 2000 square feet. We'd say, you know, for this type of thing, this is what we would do. The T team would typically be there for three hours or four hours, you know, for,, depending on the size of the team, that kind of thing. So right.

We'd set like a certain amount of time. We give you a quote for the cost and then we'd go and do it. And then if, if for some reason, you know, there was a whole section of the house that we did not anticipate that we would call and say, Hey, we need extra time. You know what I mean? So like that's kind of how we figured for the first time.

Yeah. Once people are on and they're on a regular service, it's a lot easier to, you know, like it's pretty stable. It's very, doesn't change very often. Yeah. What brought you to EO and when did you join? So, I joined EO about eight years ago. We were in this growth phase where I. I was actually, I was looking for kind of more of a community.

Um, I had had this experience I'd mentioned with BNI. Mm-hmm. And I think that's kind of what I was looking for. I really just found, I'd never heard of it before. I Googled, like, you know, business organization. So I'd been in Chamber of Commerce and you know, I know there's a bunch of different types, right.

I had a friend who was in Vistage who was, you know, they were talking to me about that. And so I just submitted a web form really on, and then somebody contacted me and. You know,, told me a lot about it. And so I showed up and had no idea what to expect and,, and honestly like, it was not quite what I was expecting when I first joined.

I was, I was kind of more expecting, I think like a lead, re lead generation and, you know, resources and people to meet in the community. And it like,, you know, just found totally unexpected from my first initial experience not knowing anything, going in what's been unexpected about it. What I've realized with my time with EO is I have am not in it for gaining clients.

I actively don't push our name, you know, out to the community. That's not really what it's, it's been for me. It's been a huge amount of personal growth, personal development. I'm on my own like entrepreneurial journey and I feel like I am, I have this. Group, you know, cliche with an eo, but like this tribe of people who are also, you know, on that same journey.

And so what I didn't expect is to fall right in and have like these really deep connections and deep friendships with all these other entrepreneurs who like share the same passion that, you know, and same frustrations, you know, and, and, that kind of thing. So the forum experience is something I feel like is totally unique in like, a lot of.

Business type organizations where you know, you can be vulnerable, you can share your successes, and you have other people who are not like coaching you how to do it. It's just like shared experience and that's like, that's been I think one of the most transformative things for me.

Aaron Burnett: Yeah. Can you think of a time during your tenure in EO.

Um, EO has really come through for you either. Yeah. A moment of crisis or a moment of

Carmine White: triumph or something in between. The one that was existential for us was COVID with a house cleaning business. We were shut down. We thought we were gonna be outta business within a span of two weeks. We lost like 70% of our recurring customers who just canceled flat out.

We were shut down for several months. And, you know, going through that experience with my forum specifically on like. Getting the PPP loans resources for that. You know, I like talking through what maybe next, like what if this business disappears, like what next? And you know, like that internal reflection was like such a valuable experience.

I don't, I think we would've kind of bounced around, you know, trying to figure out our way without like a group that I could lean on, you know?

Aaron Burnett: Yeah, I agree. It's somehow pretty special. And life changing to be able to say the terrifying thing out loud.

Carmine White: Yeah. In a room full of people who won't freak out and a room full of people who are not gonna judge you.

Right. And the other thing that has been super valuable for me is like, I'm not somebody that does a lot of introspection where I sit there and like journal and stuff like that, but the act, the act of having to sit down once a month and recall. What the past month is like and then dig deep and go to the 5% on like, these are the most, IM impactful things, but not just like what happened, but like what did that change about me?

And you know, why was it significant to me is like this. I feel like I'm a lot more in contact with how I actually feel about things. Mm-hmm. You know, just in general, just doing that exercise regularly and then having that experience with my forum and like pushing them like. You know, so what, what did that actually mean to you?

I'm hearing the story, but like, you know, and then pushing them has been, and then having them push me has been like a really, you know, part of that journey that's been really rewarding.

Aaron Burnett: Yeah.

Carmine White: So building on that, how would you say EO has changed you? I'm pretty like an introverted type of person, you know?

Um, naturally introverted, like I can be introverted.

Aaron Burnett: Two introverts are sitting

Carmine White: there. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Yeah. And normally we like, yeah, it's not like natural. Right. And,, I think pushing me out of my comfort zone in that kind of thing as far as building friendships, you know, stepping up into leadership roles has really pushed me outside of my comfort zone.

And I, I felt like that's. Translated so much into my leadership in my own company, you know, with building teams. But then my experience with leadership is, is not just telling people you know what to do. And that type of leadership in a group like your forum or in a group like the chapter, it's the same thing.

Like nobody in eo you're gonna be like, Hey, you need to go get this done. Why didn't you get this done? You know? And, as we've been leveling up our leadership team in our own company, I've noticed that same thing. Ha, you know, has brought me along where you're not leading from, you know, like I'm telling you, I'm the authority.

You go do what I say. Right? It's, it's more like, you know, how do I build the best team and how do I get the most out of them, and how can I support them to, to do you know, what they need to do. And so like that's also been part of the journey, right? Is like leadership development.

Aaron Burnett: Yeah. It's been,interesting and humbling for me to realize that building the best team, I mean earlier in my entrepreneurial journey.

I assume the best team, meant that I was intimately involved in Yes. Aspects of the company. It's humbling to realize, oh, the best team often doesn't include me.

Carmine White: Yeah. And actually like, I think an eye-opening thing for me that I've realized really in the last year Yeah. As we, as we,, like because of eo.

We've gotten into EOS. And so part of that is building out leadership team and leadership team structure. And I've realized like I'm the bottleneck in all these different things in my company and like recognizing that and like realizing that I am like holding everybody else back because of my natural, like, you know, almost controlling nature.

Yeah. Is,, you know, a, another part of the like development path on leadership.

Aaron Burnett: Yeah. So. You were an entrepreneur for years before you joined eo. Uh, can you kind of reflect and contrast your experiences as an entrepreneur before eo

Carmine White: Yeah, and after joining eo? I wish I had this resource when I was starting.

Like I, I feel like I've made so many mistakes. I see a lot of the EOA grads are, are not making like a lot of these EOA grads are coming out. With small companies with great ideas and they're already building leadership teams and like so many things that I was involved in were just like bootstrapping and then just hiring people random as much as possible and figuring it out and like understanding what it takes to be an entrepreneur.

I feel like I didn't develop that until after my experience in EL and being around other entrepreneurs and seeing how they build their businesses. A couple people in my forum had been like, just opened my eyes on what. True entrepreneurship is versus, you know, maybe the scrappy startup founder.

Aaron Burnett: Right.

You

Carmine White: know? Yeah. What do you want people to know about you? I live and breathe entrepreneurship. I love it. You know, I still read. Books, collect biographies on entrepreneurship, and I listen to podcasts and, you know, stuff that are around that. Even though I'm in it, I still find it endlessly fascinating. And so I love being part of that.

This with the, this community for that. Another thing that I've drawn on with all of this is travel. Like, I, I feel like over the last five years I've become an expert traveler. Yeah. You know, and, uh, so I love traveling and having new experiences and., you know, and sharing it with people I care about.

That's great. What is your average employee tenure? For our industry, it's very low attrition. Most of the attrition that we have is from people who start in the first couple weeks and realize they can't really handle the job. Oh, but, I think of our 60 people,, I think like 53 of them or have been with us for more than two years.

Um, so like we have some people that have been with us for 10 years. Like,, which is a long time for house cleaning industry. Yeah. So like what we've tried to create what our people are actually careers, you know, like they get benefits in 401k, you know, like we, we have this budget where we do like personal development for them.

And so like, you know, we try to approach it where we're not just like cycling bodies through Yeah. And, and billable hours, but like careers on the field, you know, for our, all our field people.

Aaron Burnett: So in contrast. How does, I mean, we can all think of other, house cleaning services with Yeah. Logos on cars driving around.

Yeah. Yeah. How do they typically

Carmine White: staff and how do they typically treat employees? Yeah. Do they have employees? So the most profitable type of business in our industry are ones that don't have an office. They don't have company vehicles. They don't do laundry. The, the most profitable is where they hire somebody on indeed.

They give them a tutorial and they say, go buy your own supplies and then go out and do this job, and then we'll pay you 50% of the, you know, whatever the cost is. That's like the most profitable way to, to do it. It's more of a lead generation company. It's a lead generation. That's a hundred percent what?

It's lead generation. So they're, they're constantly just marketing for employees and marketing for customers and that, and then they just kind of try and pair them together and collect the profit. Right, and that is. Not what we do. And there's a couple companies in our industry that are similar to us.

You know, it is a lot more expensive to have all the overhead, you know, with the office. Sure. We have two offices, overhead management to work with the teams and, and the vehicles and cell phones and all that stuff., so it is more expensive, but I feel like the only way you can really control quality and develop like a, a loyal.

Team that shows up every single day where they're not just gonna go take another job because it pays a dollar more per hour. Yeah. Is by building that. So we, we really are, you know, team first on like, like where our operations efforts are on that. There's a couple companies that that do that, but because it's a very difficult business to make profitable, like a lot of people are going away from that.

Our goal is to continue with this model. Like we would love to expand into Seattle and expand down south. Shout out for the EO thing. It is so valuable for people to have a community. Most people find community somewhere in, you know, churches or gyms, their neighborhoods, that kind of thing. And this is a community just of entrepreneurs.

Our paths may have never crossed in like any other way. Right. And so, like,, so, and I value that, like, I love that part of it. And so I, I wish I had it when I was. Starting. I had gone through my tumultuous journey of, of these other businesses. We, you know, who knows what would happen, but like I love seeing all these new business owners joining EOA and coming up through that way, or people who are just like looking for.

Place to connect, so Yeah, I do too. Yeah. Well, thank you. Awesome. This

Aaron Burnett: has been great. Thank you. Really appreciated the conversation. Yeah.

Carmine White: Yeah. This is awesome.